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Copyright © 1996-2001 Steve Krutzler and TrekWeb.COM. All Rights Reserved.
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More Press Coverage: Rick and Brannon Say Continuity No Problem & Latest Nationwide Articles |
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Posted:
09:05:53 on July 21 2001
By: Steve Krutzler
Dept: Enterprise | www.stenterprise.com
The official web site has posted part two of its belated Monday press event coverage, essentially more complete quotes from the press conference that we've been reading about. Here's one of the more interesting excerpts:
Q: Rick and Brannon, I sensed a certain weariness when talking about the Klingon makeup, and I'm wondering, the fan base being what it is, what are some of the other nitpicky things that tend to come up again and again?
BRANNON BRAGA: I can't think of any. You mean the continuity issues that the fans bring up?
Q: Yeah, the things that make your day interesting.
BRANNON BRAGA: Well, it usually has to do with mistakes we've made in episodes, referring to a room being on a certain deck and accidentally contradicting it later. Those kind of things tend to get irritating because we weren't paying close enough attention so we missed it. But ... we're too busy really to sit down and read all of the Internet mail that comes in about all of the stuff.
RICK BERMAN: If we did that, we'd have to hire other people to do the television series. About five years ago we did a feature film called "First Contact," which took place in the 21st century, and it was about an Earth that was in pretty lousy shape. But it was about the first contact with humans and Vulcans and about the first human who managed to achieve warp speed. And we knew that that period, between that guy named Zefram Cochrane and Captain Kirk, there was 200 years where Earth went from this kind of muddy little village in Montana where our film took place to the world of Kirk and Spock. And we have chosen a place kind of halfway in between to sort of create the world of "How did it all begin?" and "What was it like for the people who truly were the first people to go where no man has gone before?" So in terms of being tripped up by fan kind of things, it hasn't really been that much of a problem because we're sort of creating an era that's not yet really been explored.
Q: When you move a room from one deck to the other inadvertently, how many e-mails do you get?
RICK BERMAN: I remember in the second season of Next Generation we had a phaser beam come out of a photon torpedo port, and we got over 200 letters. And I didn't know the difference. I had no idea which one was which. 200 letters.
http://www.startrek.com/production/seriesv/articles/072001.html.
Some more press coverage of the event in papers around the country...
Enterprise Treks to Near Future - San Francisco Chronicle
New Enterprise Offers Space Travel Old-Fashioned Way - Evansville Courier & Press
The Voyages of the Starship Enterprise Go Back to the Future - Salt Lake Tribune |
TREKWEB TALKBACK
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hipocrisy
By The One
() at 01:41:01 on July 26
URL: | User Info
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To those who call us "obsessed"... if we are so involved and concerned, and you are not... why are you criticizing us? You guys are writing in to these message boards just like we are?
I accept that there are those out here who are happy with Trek... but you guys have to be open minded enough to understand that there are those of us who are not... and want Paramount to know how unhappy we are..
It seems, as far as Trek X is concerned, that some headway is being reached. Stuart Baird directing, John Logan writing... these are all BIG steps in the right direction... I myself am waiting to see.. Fresh Blood always appeals to me. Baird may have a somewhat unproven track record... but so did Nicholas Meyer.....
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Mutual Respect
By God's Media
() at 13:31:01 on July 24
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To all who would claim that some of us can be called religious nuts:
You demand respect for your beliefs but will not allow for the fact that some people may be sincerely devoted to there beliefs.
You call someone who claims the Bible as the absolute final trutha by the authority of God a "koo koo" (actual quote). And you call the belief in one God being akin to believing in the invisible man.
No one told you that you had to believe, even if that is what we believe. We make our stand as Christians because it is our right to do so, just as it is your right to disagree with us. We do not attack your faiths, we stand firmly for our faith. Before you go and point the finger of judgment in this country, remember that the laws that give you that privilege say you have it because "GOD created all men equal," it is "one nation under GOD," and these are your "GOD-given rights."
You don't have to agree, but you have no right to bash others. No one does.
My peace I leave, His peace I give you.
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Oh no ...
By Sim
(sebian@simpathy.de) at 08:55:12 on July 24
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Berman and Braga miss the point: The continuity contradictions that the fans don't want to see in Enterprise aren't these nitpicking things.
There are just some basic things that shouldn't be violated: Why would you make a prequel if you forget everything that will happen later, in the previous series?
Look at "Star Wars: Ep.1": Imagine if they put Darth Vader in the prequel, just because his mask is cool?!
You shouldn't make a prequel if you are not interested in taking care for that it fits with the other series.
So, B&B, please don't throw naked Borg girls in the series, ok?
Their intensional ignorance shown in this interview is really weak.
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The Mirror Universe
By Sankoni
() at 02:27:31 on July 24
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Okay, here's my latest theory on the nature of this "temporal cold war" thing Berman talked about.
I believe that the bad guy from the “distant future” who gives the Suliban their orders will turn out to be none other than James T. Kirk.
Not the Kirk from the “real” Star Trek Universe, of course, but the Kirk from the Mirror Universe (whom we met in “Mirror Mirror”).
At this early point in history, the Mirror Universe doesn’t exist yet. We will learn, that the Mirror Universe is, in fact, an alternate timeline. The split between the “real” Universe and the Mirror Universe will be based on events occurring during Captain Archer's times. Events that will either lead to the formation of the United Federation of Planets or the Terran Empire.
The “temporal cold war” is being fought by two competing universes. On one side we have the “real” Universe trying to keep history on its proper course, while on the other side we have the Mirror Universe fighting for its very existence.
What complicates matters even further is that the parties fighting on behalf of the “real” Universe will most likely be from the 24th century. Most likely Section 31.
While the parties fighting on behalf of the Mirror Universe will be from the 23rd century; I believe it will be Captain Kirk, fighting from a point in the Mirror Universe where Humans are still dominant.
Therefore, the very existence of the Mirror Universe depends on the actions of Captain Archer.
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continuity
By sky
() at 14:57:09 on July 23
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This weekend I watched a tape of the TOS ep "Tomorrow is Yesterday," where Kirk and crew end up the late 1960s with an Air Force pilot on board. There are many continuity points with this first season ep that cannot be reconciled in light of later Trek "canon."
In this ep, the various time travel quirks are paradozes are so lame and confusing as to be incomprehensible. Also, Kirk refers repeatedly to "Starfleet Control," not "Command." He explains that his authority comes from "The United Earth Space Probe Agency." Anybody ever heard of that beyond this ep? Will we hear about it in "Enterprise"?
Also, in this ep we learn that the pilot's son will lead the first manned mission to Saturn. If the kid would have been born in the early 70s, he would already be about 30 by the year 2001. This would imply that such a mission would be happening right about now, or within a few years, since the 30s are the prime age for astronauts.
I'm not aware that anything has otherwise been established in the Trek canon about the exploration of Saturn in the early 2000s, or any of the planets in between. So this would likely not agree with "established" Trek canon, and would be still another departure from Trek canon and the real world, just like the Eugenics Wars.
Also, in ST:TMP, "V'ger" turned out to be "Voyager 6." There were only 2 Voyager probes in the real world, so would be still another departure between Trek canon and the real world. Many similar glitches are sprinkled throughout the hundreds of hours Trek that have been filmed to date.
So it oughta be clear from even a casual viewing of Trek that there are too many inconsistencies to reconcile the eps and movies into some sort of perfectly harmonized "canon." The fact that Trekkies even use terms like "canon" in connection with continuity shows a "religious" devotion to Trek that cannot be realized from the conflicting factoids sprinkled throughout the eps.
Anyway, it seems clear that the writers of TOS and the movies did not feel that they were writing Holy Scripture for 21st century science fiction nerd-boys. I don't see that there's any reason to hold B&B to any higher standard.
I say let's just see if B&B can serve up a kickin' action show, and if it's good, let's just enjoy it. If there's a continuity glitch here and there .... BIG DEAL!!!!!!
Personally, I hope that B&B make such a serious continuity blunder that the entire timeline of TOS, TNG, DS9 and VOY can be considered to be OBLITERATED! Then maybe this series can proceed with a clean slate, and the wise words of Shatner (below) can finally be heeded by those who build their houses on the shifting sands of television productions.
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"GET A LIFE, will you people? I mean, for crying out loud, it's just a TV show! ... You've turned an enjoyable little job, that I did as a lark for a few years, into a COLOSSAL WASTE OF TIME!"
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Since when....
By God's Media
() at 09:08:26 on July 23
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Since when has anything been done for the people?
How long has it been since anyone has shown the slightest concern for their fellow human being?
We berate Mr. Berman and Mr. Braga for their flippant carelessness and disrespect for the people who would most support their efforts. But they are only evidencing the symptoms of the greater disease. These men don't care about people, they care about themselves. They couldn't give a hang about what the people say or do, so long as there is a paycheck in the mailbox at the end of their week.
And where does that paycheck come from? ...The fans? No... ...from the sponsors. That's right, the paychecks come from corporate fat-cats who have no interest in where the photon torpedoes come from or if Vulcans had laser or nuclear weapons in the 22nd century. These fat-cats just want something with a big name and bigger lights that will shine upon their products so that the gullible masses will come running to buy the latest new and improved can, box, or bag of future landfill and fill their pockets with that green god we call money.
And that's what it's all about in this modern world: the money, the power, the things we want, the me-first mentality. Human care, need, and concern is unimportant to almost everyone. Whether it is simple respect for the demands of fans for quality and continuity, or whether it is the basic need of humans to show decency and extend compassion to other humans, nobody seems to really care anymore.
Gene Roddenberry may have been a God-disliking humanist, but he envisioned something better for humanity. Roddenberry saw a time when personal lusts for money and power and the like were set aside and replaced by basic respect and compassion for other humans, and then he expanded on that concept to include even other life-forms in the universe.
Now, I am neither condemning, nor defending Mr. Berman and Mr. Braga. There are enough other souls on this site who are all too willing to do either. But I contend that while I do not like their attitudes, I am guilty of many times not caring about others for the sake of my own wants, be they money, power, control, etc.. And, I am certain that many reading this are likewise guilty. Therefore, as we look at the actions of these men, let us also look at those symptoms of their behavior that are evident in ourselves and not be so quick to judge those men for their selfish and uncaring hearts without also seeing where we ourselves are failed.
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Berman the Politician
By dpaitsel@mindspring.com
(dpaitsel@excite.com) at 23:57:00 on July 22
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I really like how B & B dismiss legitimate complaints from fans by pointing out an extreme example to make it seem like anyone who notices a continuity problem is kook. Most of the posts I've seen aren't complaints about phasers and deck numbers; they are compaints about a flagrant disregard for the established canon of the show. Series V is full of such inconsistencies, and Berman is just trying to gloss them over.
Frankly, I don't care if someone in FX makes an honest mistake and has a phaser coming out of a photon tube. Hey, we're all human and those kind of things happen. I DO care if a story doesn't make sense because it contradicts facts about the Star Trek universe that were established in previous episodes. If B & B are in charge of the Trek franchise, they OUGHT to know even more about the canon than I do. Disregarding it isn't a mistake. It's pure laziness, and it's done through a lack of respect for both the franchise and the fans. It's simply too incovenient for them to find ways to tell new stories without contradicting the stories that came before.
I realize there are some wacko geeks out there who nitpick every little mistake they can find, but using the complaints of a small minority of obsessive nut-jobs to discredit the legitimate concerns of others is contemptible. Maybe Berman should become a politician. I've seen this tactic used on countless Sunday talk shows, and it sucks just as much when it comes from Berman as when I hear it from some lying, demagogue politician.
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Phaser mistake not new to ST
By Gamera
(thebatguy@hotmail.com) at 14:49:13 on July 22
URL: http://www.geocities.com/thebatguy_99 | User Info
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OK.
Somebody goofed in the FX department and a phaser was shown firing out of a torpedo tube, or vice-versa. OH MY GOD! THE UNIVERSE IS GOING TO COLLAPSE FROM A TIME-SPACE PARADOX! Let's all tear out our hair and scream and holler! Reality as we know it is over!!! And it's all Berman and Braga's fault! Let's execute them and let the fans do the show!
Face it: mistakes happen. After all, if you remember, the same thing happened on TOS! Yes! Oh, my God, say it isn't so! It isn't possible! God himself, Gene Roddenberry (who was his own god, as a humanist that disbelieved in God, but oddly, enough, ridiculed Him at every opportunity) made that show, how can it be flawed? Yes, True Believers, in "Balance of Terror," we saw what appeared to be photon torperdoes (which had not been invented yet, according to them) shooting out of the phaser banks when he ordered phasers fired at the Romulans.
Also, in ST Five (the all time low in continuity errors) we saw photon torpedoes shoot out of the phaser bank when we all know the torpedo tubes were in the dorsal neck above the secondary hull. So, the All-Knowing Creators of the ST reality showed themselves to be flawed humans after all, and we blame them for it. They have the right take on obsessive fans who cannot tolerate error any more than Nomad could, and it self-destructed, upon learning that it's creator was flawed.
I think we have been spoiled by the extreme care and planning taken by the ST creators to keep such incidents to a minimum, because of the care they have for the show and fans. So, when they do occasionally goof, we should realise it's SO NOTICABLE because they ordinarily do so good! (Except when Bill Shatner, bless his clueless little heart, is left in charge of the store, as in ST V.)
So, I say they do care about continuity, but look at a mistake as something to learn from, not obsess over (or abcess over.)
Thank you.
-Gamera, Guardian of the Universe
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Come on now,
By The One
() at 14:30:52 on July 22
URL: | User Info
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Some of you guys are missing the point... an effort should be made to get torps vs. phasers right and whatnot... but the real issue is being missed.
CONTINUITY... from a story standpoint. Its about respecting the source material... these guys do not... my tirade in another post about their treatment of Cochrane in First Contact should illustrate what I'm talking about here. Not about where phasers are shot from, or what deck Crusher's quarters or on, etc. etc... These things are important... but not essential to telling the story.
What fans are complaining about, is altering established Trek Canon to suit the needs of the story. The idea that "we don't have time to do the research" is a major slap in the face. No effort was made to bridge the gap between FC and TOS episode "Metamorphisis". Its not that the FC version of Cochrane was unbelieveable... or not likely... but there was NO connection between the two. No effort even made. What a Travesty. The way they killed off Kirk is another example... if they had made any effort to research Kirk.. they would have seen he deserved to go out in a Blaze of glory.. not getting caught up in falling Scaffolding... Another Travesty. Kirk should have died in the middle of an intense hand to hand battle, a showdown with a Klingon at twenty paces, or saving the Enterprise the way Spock did...
What a load of crap we are handed from these idiots..
I understand what everybody is saying... and agree.. but I would rather see attention paid to Trek History. How hard can it be Braga? The Star Trek encyclopedia details just about every event that has transpired. Those people know your work better than you do!
Give Trek the respect it deserves.. if not.. go write for Baywatch... I hear it may be coming back around and looking for a few bad writers...
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HELLO!
By Spockjaw
() at 07:59:50 on July 22
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Well, I am not a huge fan of nitpicking, BUT...
Didn't Berman sound like he didn't give a crap about the 'Darmok' mistake? I mean, I remember seeing that episode for the first time, and in that particular scene saying to myself (and friends), "What the f--k?"
Berman doesn't seem to think that sort of thing is actually a mistake, whereas Braga at least admits mistakes. But lets think about it--the entire film STV was a huge mistake (with lots of little and not so little mistakes throughout), and I don't believe any of these guys had anything to do with it.
Of course, this type of thing won't keep me from watching the show (unless they go to the center of the galaxy in no time or rocket UP to DECK 78!).
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Crap, Crap, ....CRAP....
By The One
() at 20:41:54 on July 21
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Once again.. here goes Berman and Braga trying to legitimize not doing their research.... I myself don't care about a missed deck... like Steve K. said... leave it to these two to pick out an obscure complaint, and not point out the legitimate complaints by fans...
Come on guys... "we don't have time to check all the details?" Why don't you do Trek a favor then and move on to something where you can make up your own rules... If you don't care enough about the source material to do it justice then get the Hell out...
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huh?
By Jason 'Odo' Boxman
(jasonb@trekweb.com) at 17:53:17 on July 21
URL: http://edseek.com/ | User Info
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RICK BERMAN: I remember in the second season of Next Generation we had a phaser beam come out of a photon torpedo port, and we got over 200 letters. And I didn't know the difference. I had no idea which one was which. 200 letters.
You did watch the show, right?
---
-j
Web Zeus -- It Owned Us
You know you operate the servers of a popular site when trolls start taking a singular interest in you. ;)
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oh joy
By mohap
() at 14:32:30 on July 21
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I love how almost all the actors were like, "Hey we'll take some fans. It sure beats having no fans at all." In other words, "Hey we're gonna be the idolized by the nerdiest,ugliest fanbase possible. oh well, that's better than having no fans in the first place...i guess"
oh joy, i sure am looking forward to series V now. we have this cast that is already bitter from fan publicity before the show even begins. it makes you wonder doesn't it? the only motivating factor for waking up in the morning and going to work is the pay check... nothing is for the fan anymore.
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RE: oh joy
by Cymro B9 @ 18:16:20 EDT on 21 Jul
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RE: oh joy
by Steve Krutzler @ 17:57:12 EDT on 21 Jul
Trek Nit picking
By Morgar
(morganian2001@yahoo.com) at 09:56:47 on July 21
URL: http://www.e-lynch.com | User Info
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Some people do take the nitpicking thing a little too far, but I still don't think that berman or Braga have a case. Every show should maintain a degree of quality and consistency, especially a science-fiction show like Star Trek. After all, the trick of believing in a science fiction story is that it sets its own rules and then follows them. That way, for example, a robot in an Asimov story won't suddenly go berserk and start killing humans unless there's a damn good reason.
I remember the episode when the Enterprise fired a phaser beam out of the torpedo tubes. It struck me as peculiar and ruined the flow of an otherwise good episode ("Darmok"). Basically, the episode broke the rules of the Star Trek universe: there are phasers, and there are torpedos, and they do not come out of the same place. Next thing you know, we'll see Data drinking synthehol by pouring it into his pants.
So, Star Trek fans may be hard on the The Powers That Be when it comes to consistency, but Berman and Braga have very little room for complaint.
I, for one, am tired of hearing Braga's "Screw you" attitude regarding comments and complaints from fans. If they were producing on any show other than Star Trek, a production mistake as bad as the one they mentioned would be a black mark on their careers. Its only because they can make Star Trek viewers seem like fanatics that they have been able to downplay these mistakes. Other shows are drawing more and more comments and feedback from their fan base. Why is Star Trek going the opposite way?
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You will be watching ENTERPRISE because...
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