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Copyright © 1996-2001 Steve Krutzler and TrekWeb.COM. All Rights Reserved.
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Andrew Probert Criticizes Rick Berman and The Current State of Star Trek |
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Posted:
00:01:46 on July 23 2001
By: GustavoLeao
Dept: People
The Trek Brasilis website just posted an exclusive interview with lead designer Andrew Probert, one of the illustrators responsible for the look of the refit U.S.S Enterprise as seen in the first six Star Trek feature films and the creator of the Enterprise NCC 1701-D, 1701-C, the Romulan Warbird and several other ships from The Next Generation first season. In a candid interview, Probert criticizes executive producer Rick Berman ("he does not undestand what he is doing, he does not understand science fiction") and the current state of the Star Trek franchise ("I think Star Trek died when Gene died"), talks about working with Gene Roddenberry, his work for Disney Imageneering, discusses the upcoming Star Trek The Motion Picture The Director's Edition DVD and his possible involvment on the upcoming version of the Battlestar Galactica TV Series.
 
You can read the full and in-depth interview here. |
TREKWEB TALKBACK
(33 comments) |
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B+ B theory continues
By cooper2000
() at 15:53:55 on July 24
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I am another one that agrees with Andy Probert. Berman did some great stuff but he obviously doesnt really care anymore. Time to move on and same with Braga. Too bad Ron Moore wasnt still there to reinvent the faltering Trek franchise.
This isnt stated just to jump on the bandwagon of bitching about Trek just because its the in thing to do, this is coming from a Huge fan of Trek and someone who grew up with since he was a little kid in the 60s.
I agree with the post above that the star power of Spiner and Stewart have made TNG movies in to showcases for mostly their characters when TNG works best as an ensemple. Lets chalk that up to Star Egos.
Voyager? Someone mentioned above they didnt seem to be into the story of Voyager? Hmm, well, why did they create it? Voyager could have done more than any other Trek show but it fell back on to Aliens we'd seen that we shouldnt have seen and tired old generic plots. We had almost no character development and very little Crew comaraderie. They made it up as they went, tossed story archs and continuity out the door and became rich by doing so.
Trek doesnt need another series, its needs a rest so we can get the bad taste out of our mouth.
They dont seem to care anymore so why should we?
Everyone complained that Robert Beltran was complaining too much. Now Andy Probert. What so many younger Trek fans have done is settled for a mediocre product and so they keep giving us that same mediocre product. They sure dont listen to us so why should people who were involved with it try and get them to get out of their seat and write some decent stories or hire some people that know the basic pricibles of writing a Sci-Fi show? If they dont know how to do this and from watching most Voyager Episodes, I dont think they do, then they shouldnt be doing what they are doing?
I see the polls the day after Trek airs and even after the worse epiosdes you get people rating the show as Above Average?
Shows like B5 and Farscape surprise us and challenge us. We have characters we care about. Why cant Trek do that? I use to think about TOS and TNG like that. Sadly, I never did with Voyager and DS9, well, that goes back to having good writers and trying...Something Different.
I fear that Enterprise will try to be too much like TOS and try to duplicate that type of energy again but you need good stories to keep us watching.
With the next Movie, it could go either way. I have seen some good ideas but its still the Data and Picard show. Wheres Beverlys juicy roll for a change. Watch "Remember Me" again and tell me she cant hold her own on screen. I think you still have too many influences in the background to change a powerful script into just another glorified episode like Insurrection. That comes from Bermans approval which as I said above I question now adays and then you got Spiner with the story credit. He didnt like his character in the last one so why not write a script with MORE screen time for himself.
My hope for Treks future is small. Sure, Id love them to proove that I am wrong but with all the damage they have done to the franchise up until now, is that possible?
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andrew proberts comments represent old and tired guard
By madspector
() at 02:23:09 on July 24
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why can Andrew Probert and others get over the fact this isnt this 1966, that while the concept that Roddenberry created was about exploration and meeting new aliens was a great start it needed to evolve beyond that, even gene knew it. Furthermore why bash berman and bragga for realizing that work worked in the past is probrably not going to work in modern times, why insult them and say that they dont know science fiction just because they refuse to stick business as usual used up and really tired concept of of "lets beam down to planets surface...watch the un named guy in the red shirt get killed every episode" and after its all over we beam back up and have a happy ending. That may sell to the fossilized generation of trek fans but it wont sell to new one, Like them or not, Berman and Bragga and introduced trek to a whole new group of people...old trek guard of fans isnt going to hack it any more niether is the 60 approach to star trek. B and B have seen that. I thik its Probert and guys like him that dont know sci fi, maybe he should read the time machine, build one and use to get ito the current century.
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Probert's Right: Berman doesn't get it
By Fortec
() at 02:02:03 on July 24
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I agree with Mr. Probert. While Gene was living, every season of Star Trek offered many jewels. Now? We were lucky to get ONE outstanding episode per season out of Voyager. While Gene was about using the Trek universe to touch on topics in our society, it has now become not about the story but about copying what other shows have done - taking the easy road. Prime Example: The show's title is the name of a starship, whose captain (played by an actor made famous as the lead character in another genre show) is travelling around space trying to get other races to join in on his peaceful, intersteller organization. It appears the show will have a reoccurring group of bad guys in the show, whose race is obsessed with genetics & genetic purity.
Now - Was I talking about "Andromeda" or "Enterprise"? ;^)
Rick Berman, Brannon Braga and gang could not hatch an original idea even if something came up, stung'em and laid original-idea-eggs under their skin. Viacom/Paramount needs to get the entire creative staff out of there and bring in a group of people that can actually THINK for themselves. They did it first with Deep Space Nine ("God forbid we let Babylon 5 be the only option for a space station show on television!" The only thing that saves DS9 from the trash heap was the later seasons' writing of Robert Hewitt Wolfe!), they did it with Voyager (Trek's poor version of Lost In Space) and they are doing it again with Enterprise.
People use the cop out excuse that it is only about the money. Sure - now it is with Rick "Ima Puppet" Berman. But to Gene it was his child. It was his way to put his ideas and philosophy about our society in front of people and make them think. While Gene wanted the BEST for Trek, despite what other's were doing, Berman only wants what has worked for others in the past/present. His imagination goes as far as the dollar sign. Only when the ratings drop further will Viacom/Paramount see the writing on the wall and get someone at the Trek helm that CARES about the show and it's message. Many fans of TNG and TOS did not watch the last 2 Trek series because it was too "watered down" (actual quote from someone I work with). If they would just go back to pushing the envelope and write shows with meat in them, like TOS & TNG, then some of the lost fans will return.
As for Enterprise's similarities to Andromeda - Oh well - If they are gonna steal ideas, why not steal them from the late creator of Trek? :-/
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Maybe Berman, et al, should watch "Stargate SG-1"
By Ptrope
(ptrope@netdirect.net) at 21:53:02 on July 23
URL: http://www.ptrope.com/gedwards | User Info
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I agree with Andy Probert; Trek has devolved from a show about exploration, and the possibilities in the universe, into a lot of recycled bad ideas. Sure, it's had its moments, in all series: the Q's suicide in Voyager, Sisko's log about dragging the Romulans into the Dominion War (a concept that almost completely violated the spirit of Trek), and of course, "The Inner Light" in TNG. Frankly, I thought Voyager was nearly a complete waste of time; Lost in Space was taken off the air for a reason! And the movies have become action flicks starring Stewart and Spiner, not Trek.
At this point, Stargate SG-1 seems a great example of what's possible with SF on TV. Exploration, valid SF concepts, and, yes, they still even manage to get in some wanton gunplay; overall, though, it's a decent show about characters, about ideas, even about the cooperation of different cultures. And, from what I've seen, Enterprise looks to be contemporary enough to SG-1 that maybe, given the right people, they could explore similar concepts, without stealing them outright, of course.
I don't think that the issue is getting "real" SF writers. Unfortunately, it seems that a lot of today's SF authors cut their teeth on Star Trek novels, rather than creating their own, unique visions. SF is about possibilities, but like any good writing, it's about people. What Trek needs, in any incarnation, is writers who understand that the best stories are ones where the viewers become involved in the characters, not just the effects and space battles. Good writers understand that the characters aren't the only ones exploring; the viewers should experience that discovery as well. Sure, as it stands now, our entire culture revolves around instant gratification, where people just want to be entertained, and not left to think about what they've seen or done. But are Trek fans really like that? And isn't now the time to bring in some new fans who can discover something other than the spectacular beauty of yet another starship blowing up? Maybe Berman doesn't understand this; reading some of his quotes, he seems to display a growing disregard for the ideas that made Trek worthwhile, not to mention a growing disregard for the people who made it worth bringing back: the fans. They're not stupid; they deserve a good Trek. If Berman is unwilling or unable to take the time, to make the effort, to create a good show, then maybe it's time to kill the golden goose.
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Probert is partially correct
By Sub-Odeon
(subodeon@qwest.net) at 14:18:21 on July 23
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I don't think Star Trek necessarily died with Gene. I think Trek actually had some really fine moments after Gene's death, and I don't want to take any of that away.
But where I think Probert is on the money is in calling attention to the fact that the prime minds behind Trek (the infamous B+B duo) have lost their way. B+B have really been working on Star Trek too long. They are stale, too quick to take the fans for granted, and lose more and more respect for the canon of the program with each series they create.
ENTERPRISE is a great idea, but in the hands of B+B I fear that ENTERPRISE is going to do lethal damage to Trek canon and story continuity. And I can't think of any better way to ruin the Trek world than by disregarding canon. The long-time fans will get turned off and leave, and the new fans will sour on the shows wayward focus. Trek is too special for this fate, and deserves better handlers. B+B have passed their prime and Paramount needs to find a new mind or minds who will revive the franchise and get the damned thing back on a good course!
As for Braga, on a personal level, I don't think he could write his way out of a paper bag. He is resorting to hack plot contrivances on a regular basis and couldn't hold his own against real SF writers like Niven or Robinson even if said real SF writers had both hands tied behind their backs. Perhaps even more than Berman, Braga needs to get shipped out!
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Bravo!!
By Mr. Peabody
() at 13:55:24 on July 23
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I feel really good reading a dissenting opinion of ReichMarshall Berman's destruction of Trek, coming from a veteran that really knows how it's done.
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The Evolution Of Trek
By joe8000
() at 13:49:27 on July 23
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Berman says that the new characters on Enterprise will perceive the galaxy differently than their Next Generation and Voyager counterparts, with awe and wonder, he says. I think part of this awe and wonder must come from encountering aliens worlds, ships, and phenomena that is so bizarre and strange looking and feeling that it inspires or evokes those feelings. I have heard many newer fans from a younger generation, raised on shows like the X-files and not the Next Generation, complain about how the aliens on Voyager acted and looked too human, about how the alien ships and alien worlds on Voyager were not realistic. Look at the difference between the Planet Apes movies. I don't think today's fans would buy the premise of the new movie version if the makeup, speical effects, design and production had been the same as they were in the original movie. Likewise, the aliens and alien worlds on Enterprise must evolve as well. The impression I got from the article was that, at least in terms of ship design, Berman liked to play it safe. However, what he needs to do is to take risks. Makeup, special effects, and design, have come a long way since the Next Generation. Voyager did not reflect this, hopefully the new show will.
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Good Interview
By Jean-Luc
(cooljeanluc@startrekmail.com) at 08:40:25 on July 23
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I hope he gets work on 'Galactica'.
I wonder if it was translated from Spanish, though. There are some sentences that I read twice but still couldn't make sense of like, "The project starts to begin completion, they start to leave people along."
---
"I am...fully functional, programmed in multiple techniques."
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Trek died with Gene Rodennberry? WTF?
By dickcabeza
() at 02:28:59 on July 23
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Oh, you mean the crappy first 2 seasons of TNG? Sorry to say but Trek improved after GR's death or after he lost control (see TNG seasons 3-6 and most of DS9).
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ENTERPRISE has been revealed this week and we'd like to know how you would rate the show so far based on the new Enterprise NX-01, the interior set design, the new costumes, and any other info that you may already possess!
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